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Replica guns seized from collector
12:40pm Friday 19th October 2007
Comments (114) Have your say »
Armed police swooped on the flat of a 54-year-old replica pistol collector in Battersea.
They seized 17 replica guns but police admit the man posed no threat to the community.
Wandsworth crime squad Inspector Matt Phelps said police had raided the flat about 10.20am on October 10 after a tip-off from the public.
"This action was taken to pro-actively reduce the threat of firearm incidents in the borough and to prevent any possible tragic consequences should they have made their way into the wrong hands," Insp Phelps said after the weapons had been handed over.
"Most imitation weapons are exact copies of the real thing and this places armed officers in the almost impossible position of having to make an instant judgment on whether a gun is real or not.
"I would like to thank the local residents who had the foresight to bring this collection to our attention, and the owner for his full co-operation."
Police said local residents had raised concerns that the man had a large number of replica firearms and ammunition on display in his home.
It turned out the 54-year-old had been collecting the gun memorabilia over 20 years and had built up an extensive collection.
Specialist CO19 firearms officers found 17 of the guns were exact replicas and could be converted to fire.
The Met said in a statement that "although there was no concern that the owner of the collection posed a threat himself, the firearms that had been identified by officers as susceptible to conversion were retained as a precautionary measure" and will be destroyed.
Your Say YourStreatham Guardian
Dennis, The American Colonies says...
7:26am Sat 20 Oct 07
Just you wait! The next raid will be on the offices of This Is Local London for having a photograph of replica firearms.
M. O'Reilly, usa says...
1:12pm Sat 20 Oct 07
This is why we kicked you out of our country-insane oppression sans logic. Maybe you can come back when he's 74 and bag another 20...
Peter, says...
5:30pm Sat 20 Oct 07
You poor sorry b@stards. What has happened to you? Your grandfathers ran an Empire, and here you all are cowering at plastic, fake, guns.
The only good aspect is that I've been able to buy three of the very fine Enfield rifles you are all suddenly scared of.
The only good aspect is that I've been able to buy three of the very fine Enfield rifles you are all suddenly scared of.
yog-sothoth, says...
5:45pm Sat 20 Oct 07
It's hard to believe this is the same nation which stood alone to defy the might and malice of the Wehrmacht which had just taken all of Europe. Your forebears are turning over in their graves. You have become a nation of grovelers. When you become Dhimmis you will deserve it.
Steve, USA says...
6:33pm Sat 20 Oct 07
You people are pathetic if you put up with this crap
Greg Scott, New York says...
6:47pm Sat 20 Oct 07
While your rights are being violated you do nothing. In 5 years your nation will cease to exist. You have placed your security in the hands of others what do you think the end result is? Civil war. Remember humanity did just fine with rock and clubs for tens of thousands of years if the government keeps pushing its all over.
Rob A., Standish, Maine, USA says...
4:06am Sun 21 Oct 07
Winston Churchill would be so ashamed.
Mopar, says...
2:32pm Sun 21 Oct 07
Wow!
Just wow.
Just wow.
Terry, says...
3:50pm Sun 21 Oct 07
1984 has arrived - 23 years late but here never-the-less. The UK, where the police rely on informers to keep the subjects "safe", the police laud the dobbers and ubiquitous CCTV keeps a 'benevolent' eye on the serfs. The country that gave the world the notion of personal freedom is itself losing it in the name of safety.
Fred, townsville says...
1:49am Mon 22 Oct 07
Sad isn't, replica toy guns, the police should have a look at them selves, remember the innocent fellow who was on the train shot because he looked suspicious, no one was charged.
Croyboy, says...
8:43am Mon 22 Oct 07
Great job, plods!
Now perhaps you can confiscate real guns from real criminals.
Oh, by the way: "Armed police swooped on the flat..."
Why armed? Were you going to shoot him seven times in the head if he resisted your taking his legally-held collection?
Now perhaps you can confiscate real guns from real criminals.
Oh, by the way: "Armed police swooped on the flat..."
Why armed? Were you going to shoot him seven times in the head if he resisted your taking his legally-held collection?
Peter, Amsterdam says...
9:53am Mon 22 Oct 07
Hey people, this is nothing.
Prepare yourselves cos the New World Order is coming to the UK soon.
Prepare yourselves cos the New World Order is coming to the UK soon.
Chris in Florida, says...
9:56am Mon 22 Oct 07
When the Muslims take over your country then all your enemies will have AK47's. The people need to rise up now before it's too late. Shame to see such a powerful country turn into victims.
Jim, Australia says...
10:00am Mon 22 Oct 07
You poor bloody Poms,
No wonder you all want to migrate to other countries. History will condemn the generation that allowed this to happen. To think that 60 years ago the Union Jack was a symbol of liberty from oppression in Europes darkest days. You people should be marching in the streets in protest or are you all too scared??
No wonder you all want to migrate to other countries. History will condemn the generation that allowed this to happen. To think that 60 years ago the Union Jack was a symbol of liberty from oppression in Europes darkest days. You people should be marching in the streets in protest or are you all too scared??
Great Britain, ENGLAND says...
1:02pm Mon 22 Oct 07
American's offering opinions on the state of our country... Absolutely laughable..
Rocketman, Indiana says...
3:58pm Mon 22 Oct 07
Judging from the almost total lack of civil liberties in England nowadays it seems to me that a American style Libertarian Party is desperately needed.
KZ, England says...
4:02pm Mon 22 Oct 07
"lack of civil liberties in England.."
Abundant in the states are they? Shall we ask the Jena 6 that question?
Abundant in the states are they? Shall we ask the Jena 6 that question?
Jason, California says...
8:10pm Mon 22 Oct 07
Yes, the American style Libertarian Party is desperately needed in the USA too.
Is that supposed to disprove your need for it?
Is that supposed to disprove your need for it?
Alan, St Alburn says...
9:27pm Mon 22 Oct 07
When I read this my hart goes out to all those who died for no reason in the world wars, both sides, this is what we fought against, other fought to keep, a state that decides you MIGHT be harmful and takes action. If this is the trend I hope I can use the same laws to have many drivers on our roads arrested and their cars confiscated and destroyed, as many of them are potential accidents waiting to happen and may potentially harm people.
How cry the beloved country
How cry the beloved country
Rudi, New Brunswick, Canada says...
9:48pm Mon 22 Oct 07
I think I have seen this movie before, something about total government control and lack of civil liberties.
Charles F., says...
11:19pm Mon 22 Oct 07
England has turned into a nation of sissies and wankers.
CCTV cameras, wogs as thick as fleas on a dogs ****, crime running rampant. But by God, you've still got television, so it's all ok with you.
CCTV cameras, wogs as thick as fleas on a dogs ****, crime running rampant. But by God, you've still got television, so it's all ok with you.
Keith, Pennsylvania says...
6:05am Tue 23 Oct 07
What happened to you Brits?! Both Sir Winston Churchill and Sir Bernard Montgomery, who were proud, brave, and honorable, must be crying above in Heaven after seeing that you folks have reduced yourselves to a bunch of cowards after all of these years. It's disgusting that you folks are now afraid of toy guns. Are you afraid of your own shadows as well? It's no wonder that the Muslims, especially the radicals, are having such an easy time taking over your country. Those radical Muslims won't need to fire a shot from their weapons when they can simply say "Boo!" and you'll run away from them and hide underneath your beds. You people today make the French look very brave.
First of all, you Brits need to get some common sense by getting rid of these stupid laws. Criminals don't obey laws in the first place. After that, you had better be brave, just like your proud ancestors, and take back your country if you still want it to be known as England and not Anglistan.
First of all, you Brits need to get some common sense by getting rid of these stupid laws. Criminals don't obey laws in the first place. After that, you had better be brave, just like your proud ancestors, and take back your country if you still want it to be known as England and not Anglistan.
Peter, Amsterdam says...
7:58am Tue 23 Oct 07
Britain has become a DISGUSTING country! What more can I say.
You lot are the laughing stock of the world.
You lot are the laughing stock of the world.
KZ, England says...
9:50am Tue 23 Oct 07
Jason wrote:No not at all, its suppose point out that people in glass houses should not be throwing stones..
Yes, the American style Libertarian Party is desperately needed in the USA too. Is that supposed to disprove your need for it?
A Passer By, London says...
10:01am Tue 23 Oct 07
The Police have done a good thing here. Unfortunately we live in a society where people take what others have got... These guns could be converted, people in the neighbourhood knew about them, so all it would take is for a gang to break in, take them and then convert them.. The results would have been a lot worse than they stand at the moment and then everyone would have been in uproar about how the police should have done something.
We can be called all names under the sun but it still stands that heaven forbid we should become like America in any way shape or form!!
We can be called all names under the sun but it still stands that heaven forbid we should become like America in any way shape or form!!
Steve, U.S.A. says...
1:34pm Tue 23 Oct 07
American's offering opinions on the state of our country... Absolutely laughable..
Armed Police taking toy guns from old man...Now that's absolutely laughable.
I didn't know you Brits were so scared of old men with toy guns. Now you are scared of Americans with snide comments.
I'm not really scared of anything you have to threaten me with, though. You don't even have so much as a toy gun to do it with.
george n, USA says...
1:40pm Tue 23 Oct 07
"We can be called all names under the sun but it still stands that heaven forbid we should become like America in any way shape or form."
Yes, heaven forbid. You are giving everything away you (and many others) fought for for the last 200 years, and you are too blind to see it. Pathetic.
Yes, heaven forbid. You are giving everything away you (and many others) fought for for the last 200 years, and you are too blind to see it. Pathetic.
Great Britain, ENGLAND says...
1:51pm Tue 23 Oct 07
Guns are illegal in this country, whether they take it away from an old man or not makes no difference whatsoever..
Who is scared of 'Americans with snide comments' certainly not me. Your comments do me no harm whatsoever Although considering your answer to anything is to shoot it I probably should be..
"I'm not really scared of anything you have to threaten me with, though"
Now you see? That is where we differ, I don't feel the need to threaten anyone, I do not think I am bigger and better than I am . We don't need guns, real or toy to prove ourselves.
Who is scared of 'Americans with snide comments' certainly not me. Your comments do me no harm whatsoever Although considering your answer to anything is to shoot it I probably should be..
"I'm not really scared of anything you have to threaten me with, though"
Now you see? That is where we differ, I don't feel the need to threaten anyone, I do not think I am bigger and better than I am . We don't need guns, real or toy to prove ourselves.
A Passer By, London says...
1:56pm Tue 23 Oct 07
george n wrote:What precisely are we giving away? "The right to bear arms?" That never existed in this country dear, we've never been that intent on violence..
"We can be called all names under the sun but it still stands that heaven forbid we should become like America in any way shape or form." Yes, heaven forbid. You are giving everything away you (and many others) fought for for the last 200 years, and you are too blind to see it. Pathetic.
Plus, I would rather give everything away than attempt to take what doesn't belong to me...
L. L. Lucullus, St. Louis, MO (USA) says...
2:30pm Tue 23 Oct 07
A Passer By writes "Plus, I would rather give everything away than attempt to take what doesn't belong to me..."
Are you seriously suggesting that the alternative to pacifism is thievery?
If you would not take the property of others without permission, good for you. I would not do so either. If you would permit another to take your property, by force, without resisting, I am sorry for you and sorrier for those who depend upon you. I choose to defend my property, my life, and what rights remain mine in our "enlightened" age. So did your countrymen, until quite recently.
Hic jacet Brittanius - Vir quondam atque futurus.
Are you seriously suggesting that the alternative to pacifism is thievery?
If you would not take the property of others without permission, good for you. I would not do so either. If you would permit another to take your property, by force, without resisting, I am sorry for you and sorrier for those who depend upon you. I choose to defend my property, my life, and what rights remain mine in our "enlightened" age. So did your countrymen, until quite recently.
Hic jacet Brittanius - Vir quondam atque futurus.
Collector, Canada says...
2:52pm Tue 23 Oct 07
I just don't understand why armed police would raid the home of this person and seize a collection. For 20 years this individual was able to legally purchase (assumption) his collection. Then suddenly, arbitrarily this freedom is taken away from him. I have to hope this will never happen to me without cause. I have a similar collection, but I own no fakes. Truth is, regardless of what one ownes, you really can't fight the authorities. I will just have to hope Canada will respect my ownership and not become what it seems much of Europe has become in respect to firearms. I have to admit, that it seems unlikely I will die an old man with my guns still in my possession. It appears most governments have been steadily barring it's civillian populace from firearms ownership. It will probably only ever get worse for all of us.
Keith, USA says...
3:02pm Tue 23 Oct 07
Here's a well-known quote:
"Those who wish to trade their liberty for security shall deserve neither."
"Those who wish to trade their liberty for security shall deserve neither."
A Passer By, London says...
3:34pm Tue 23 Oct 07
L. L. Lucullus wrote:
"If you would permit another to take your property, by force, without resisting, I am sorry for you and sorrier for those who depend upon you. I choose to defend my property, my life, and what rights remain mine in our "enlightened" age. So did your countrymen, until quite recently."
Don't feel sorry for me LL... I did not once say that I would not defend myself or my property but you see, I realise that property and material things can be replaced... When you shoot someone's brains out that life cannot be replaced. If you wish for me to adopt the opinion that this would be acceptable over a car, phone, necklace, watch or whatever, then you are sadly mistaken and it is in fact yourself you should bestow your pity on...
"Go in through the narrow gate; because broad and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are the ones going in through it; whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are the ones finding it."
"If you would permit another to take your property, by force, without resisting, I am sorry for you and sorrier for those who depend upon you. I choose to defend my property, my life, and what rights remain mine in our "enlightened" age. So did your countrymen, until quite recently."
Don't feel sorry for me LL... I did not once say that I would not defend myself or my property but you see, I realise that property and material things can be replaced... When you shoot someone's brains out that life cannot be replaced. If you wish for me to adopt the opinion that this would be acceptable over a car, phone, necklace, watch or whatever, then you are sadly mistaken and it is in fact yourself you should bestow your pity on...
"Go in through the narrow gate; because broad and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are the ones going in through it; whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are the ones finding it."
george n, usa says...
3:44pm Tue 23 Oct 07
So your property is the property of anyone who wants it because it is not worth defending...how nice. Some of us have to work very hard for the things we have, and the life we have made for ourselves. Obviously not an issue for you. Common property for anyone "according to their needs.." Hmmm, where have I heard that before?
george n, USA says...
3:53pm Tue 23 Oct 07
No intent on violence!?!?!?! What do you call what you did to the indigenous populations of most of the countries when you were an Empire. Particularly India??? Or maybe several nations in Africa.?? Or maybe those pesky rebels in the colonies???
This whole thing is degrading onto a name calling contest.
The rights I am refering to are things like being secure in your own house from searches and seizures. Taking property away without due cause ("dangerous" toys), and the like.
The Brits helped my folks maintain their freedome when the Nazi's marched into my homeland in Greece. We still are in your debt. I just feel very badly that your society has come to this.
This whole thing is degrading onto a name calling contest.
The rights I am refering to are things like being secure in your own house from searches and seizures. Taking property away without due cause ("dangerous" toys), and the like.
The Brits helped my folks maintain their freedome when the Nazi's marched into my homeland in Greece. We still are in your debt. I just feel very badly that your society has come to this.
A Passer By, London says...
4:35pm Tue 23 Oct 07
George, George, George, I too have to work hard for what I have... However, I still recognise that life is more important than objects regardless of how hard I've had to work to get them. I know what is a necessity in my life and what isnt. Its the adoption of certain attitudes that has lead the world to value things more than people, and very much to blame for the societies we ALL live in.
So George, how do you secure your house from searches and seizures lets say twenty police storm your home, are you going to blow their brains out? If they confiscate your gun because theres a chance it might be illegal, are you going to shoot them? You see, this is why our police are allowed to do such things, in order that we avoid such tragedies as those seen by countries where guns are legal and handed out like sweets.
I know its time to pack up and leave when I can go to a bank to open an account and be given a gun to boot!!
There are many reasons that our society has come to what it has, but please dont think that American influence isnt one of them
'This whole thing is degrading onto a name calling contest.'
Look back over the comments, the name calling started long before I got involved and all because some guns were confiscated in a country where guns are illegal.... Please. I hope to see all your comments again when a drug den is raided, and drugs are confiscated...
So George, how do you secure your house from searches and seizures lets say twenty police storm your home, are you going to blow their brains out? If they confiscate your gun because theres a chance it might be illegal, are you going to shoot them? You see, this is why our police are allowed to do such things, in order that we avoid such tragedies as those seen by countries where guns are legal and handed out like sweets.
I know its time to pack up and leave when I can go to a bank to open an account and be given a gun to boot!!
There are many reasons that our society has come to what it has, but please dont think that American influence isnt one of them
'This whole thing is degrading onto a name calling contest.'
Look back over the comments, the name calling started long before I got involved and all because some guns were confiscated in a country where guns are illegal.... Please. I hope to see all your comments again when a drug den is raided, and drugs are confiscated...
Colin, Vancouver, Canada says...
5:15pm Tue 23 Oct 07
This is not about guns or replicas, this about your rights and the fact that they are slipping away. Did this man break any laws? Clearly from the article he is not a threat and cooperated like a lawful citizen. The reasons given for seizure are weak and would not likely stand the test in a court of law, but I suspect the authorities bet on the fact that most people dont have the money to fight them. Britons make fun of Americans, but at least the Americans take their rights very strongly and resist attempts to limit them. Freedom and rights are hard won and easily lost. Vigilance against abuse by the state even from the best intentions is always required. Britain is sliding down a slope it may not recover from. Benevolent oppression is still oppression. If you dont stand up for others rights, who will stand up for you when they come for yours?
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
5:18pm Tue 23 Oct 07
"Plus, I would rather give everything away than attempt to take what doesn't belong to me..."
Oh the sorrow - how many British and Americans died in the 20th century to protect your country from a police state.
YOU just did. When armed police can come into your house (raid) and take away toy guns for what MIGHT be done...
Whats next, your steak knives, cricket bats, wait I know, your wankers because they can become hard and MIGHT hurt someone. Hell, its obvious that you aren't using those parts anyways.
Oh the sorrow - how many British and Americans died in the 20th century to protect your country from a police state.
YOU just did. When armed police can come into your house (raid) and take away toy guns for what MIGHT be done...
Whats next, your steak knives, cricket bats, wait I know, your wankers because they can become hard and MIGHT hurt someone. Hell, its obvious that you aren't using those parts anyways.
johny appleseed, USA says...
5:44pm Tue 23 Oct 07
Hey brits,
would you all mind if we shipped our liberals and demoncraps over to you?
They should feel right at home over there where your criminals have more right to your property than you do....
would you all mind if we shipped our liberals and demoncraps over to you?
They should feel right at home over there where your criminals have more right to your property than you do....
Mongo, USA says...
7:47pm Tue 23 Oct 07
Collector wrote:
I just don't understand why armed police would raid the home of this person and seize a collection. For 20 years this individual was able to legally purchase (assumption) his collection. Then suddenly, arbitrarily this freedom is taken away from him. I have to hope this will never happen to me without cause. I have a similar collection, but I own no fakes. Truth is, regardless of what one ownes, you really can't fight the authorities. I will just have to hope Canada will respect my ownership and not become what it seems much of Europe has become in respect to firearms. I have to admit, that it seems unlikely I will die an old man with my guns still in my possession. It appears most governments have been steadily barring it's civillian populace from firearms ownership. It will probably only ever get worse for all of us.
Truth is, regardless of what one ownes, you really can't fight the authorities. I will just have to hope Canada will respect my ownership and not become what it seems much of Europe has become in respect to firearms.
You had best give up your weapons now, with your attitude. Here is a quote from Samuel Adams, in a speech at the Philadelphia State House, August 1, 1776
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace.
We ask not your counsels or arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."
So much for the authorities...
Keith, USA says...
8:27pm Tue 23 Oct 07
johny appleseed wrote:That's not a bad idea at all! They can have our liberals and demoncraps while England can give us their conservatives and anyone else who wants to have some real freedoms. It seems like a fair trade to me.
Hey brits, would you all mind if we shipped our liberals and demoncraps over to you? They should feel right at home over there where your criminals have more right to your property than you do....
BIG BROTHER, Airstrip One says...
7:18am Wed 24 Oct 07
Repeat after me, Britain.
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
Steve, U.S.A. says...
1:34pm Wed 24 Oct 07
I wonder why it is that people in other nations equate handguns with violence? I have carried a handgun on my side for five years, and I've never had the inclination to randomly commit violent acts. It has become a comfort knowing that I am trusted as a citizen to protect my own life and the lives of my family.
I think it is SHAMEFUL that there are people out there who actually BRAG ABOUT the superiority of their society in not needing guns. HOW ARROGANT!
Especially since it is so shameful that you insist that another human being (police officer)risk their lives to protect something you are unwilling to protect yourself.
You Brits have sadly given up the CIVIL RIGHT to protect yourself.....FOR ALL TIME! Let's see if your superior society will ever see fit to return it to you. Unfotunately, you have willingly given up the means to fight for any other right they now want to remove. Of course now, you no longer have the MEANS to fight, not to mention the WILL to do so.
And you're proud of that?
I think it is SHAMEFUL that there are people out there who actually BRAG ABOUT the superiority of their society in not needing guns. HOW ARROGANT!
Especially since it is so shameful that you insist that another human being (police officer)risk their lives to protect something you are unwilling to protect yourself.
You Brits have sadly given up the CIVIL RIGHT to protect yourself.....FOR ALL TIME! Let's see if your superior society will ever see fit to return it to you. Unfotunately, you have willingly given up the means to fight for any other right they now want to remove. Of course now, you no longer have the MEANS to fight, not to mention the WILL to do so.
And you're proud of that?
David, Sunny Florida, USA says...
2:22pm Wed 24 Oct 07
A man that takes your gold chain today, will take your daughter's gold chain tomorrow, or your Mother's gold chain. He'll go on, taking whatever he wants, whenever he wants. He'll take lives, he'll brutalize innocents, and he'll do so with pleasure. He'll do so until he's stopped.
If it takes a bullet to the brainpan to stop him from hurting my daughter, or anyone I kow, the so be it. The wages of sin is death. This is my justification for being prepared to defend myself, and any of my loved ones, with whatever force I can muster.
What's your justification for not doing so?
If it takes a bullet to the brainpan to stop him from hurting my daughter, or anyone I kow, the so be it. The wages of sin is death. This is my justification for being prepared to defend myself, and any of my loved ones, with whatever force I can muster.
What's your justification for not doing so?
Mark, Missouri, USA says...
3:30pm Wed 24 Oct 07
In Missouri USA we are a "free people", who's rights began in English Common law that you all invented. The difference here is that we live what we believe. I am free to carry a loaded firearm on my person or in my vehicle at will, have as many guns as I want to collect, and use them to defend myself against intruders, robbers, car-jackers and those that would do me harm without fear of prosecution.
What a wonderful place I live! Too bad for you! I won't be visiting there for certain!
What a wonderful place I live! Too bad for you! I won't be visiting there for certain!
Great Britain, ENGLAND says...
3:38pm Wed 24 Oct 07
"I think it is SHAMEFUL that there are people out there who actually BRAG ABOUT the superiority of their society in not needing guns. HOW ARROGANT!" Funny you should say that since quite a few of the USA comments here are alluding to the fact that the USA is superior to Britain. In fact, in one of your earlier comments, didn't you call us 'pathetic'???
But I think what is both SHAMEFUL and ARROGANT is trying to justify carrying and using a weapon that is DESIGNED to KILL and cause BLOODSHED..
In this country, people who go round shooting others go to PRISON. Carrying a gun is not seen as the norm.
Its not about the superiority of our Society.. Not at all.. Its about the individuals understanding of what is acceptable and what isn't.... There are two types of people in British Society, those that carry guns and those that don't. There is uproar here at the moment about the ones who choose to carry them because they are stripping people of lives based on the fact that the gun carrier thinks they deserve it.. This can be because someone asks you to put a cigarette out, looked at you the wrong way, or stepped on your foot
You Brits have sadly given up the CIVIL RIGHT to protect yourself...FOR ALL TIME! Let's see if your superior society will ever see fit to return it to you. Worry about your own society Steve, it needs it. Leave the worrying about ours to us.
The arrogance also lies in all the comments calling Brits names You are all logging on to a news website for a different country just to throw insults because we dont do things as you do Odd that. I wouldnt mind if you lived in a perfect society, but you dont. Nowhere near. As someone above mentioned. People who live in glass houses should not be throwing stones..
David...
"The wagers of sin is death"
David, you need to pick up a bible and find out what that really means.... It quite seems that you are suggesting that you are not a sinner.. NEWSFLASH. You are.
But I think what is both SHAMEFUL and ARROGANT is trying to justify carrying and using a weapon that is DESIGNED to KILL and cause BLOODSHED..
In this country, people who go round shooting others go to PRISON. Carrying a gun is not seen as the norm.
Its not about the superiority of our Society.. Not at all.. Its about the individuals understanding of what is acceptable and what isn't.... There are two types of people in British Society, those that carry guns and those that don't. There is uproar here at the moment about the ones who choose to carry them because they are stripping people of lives based on the fact that the gun carrier thinks they deserve it.. This can be because someone asks you to put a cigarette out, looked at you the wrong way, or stepped on your foot
You Brits have sadly given up the CIVIL RIGHT to protect yourself...FOR ALL TIME! Let's see if your superior society will ever see fit to return it to you. Worry about your own society Steve, it needs it. Leave the worrying about ours to us.
The arrogance also lies in all the comments calling Brits names You are all logging on to a news website for a different country just to throw insults because we dont do things as you do Odd that. I wouldnt mind if you lived in a perfect society, but you dont. Nowhere near. As someone above mentioned. People who live in glass houses should not be throwing stones..
David...
"The wagers of sin is death"
David, you need to pick up a bible and find out what that really means.... It quite seems that you are suggesting that you are not a sinner.. NEWSFLASH. You are.
Steve, U.S.A. says...
4:45pm Wed 24 Oct 07
First let me apologize for seeming to mock your society. I, as an American, am thankful for having your country as close allies. I would never think of the British people in a derogatory manner, so if I seem to come off as insulting, I'm truly sorry.
But, having said that, I do think there's a bit of arrogance in the attitude that you are morally better by not needing guns. I'm sure there are more than a few people in your country who's lives could have been saved by having had the capability of defending themselves.
The term pathetic I used refers to the belief that by passing a law, you somehow make everyone safer. How naive. I guess all the criminals will just stop being criminals because it's against the law.
I guess you'll just have to rely on others to protect you from now on because you have given up the right to do it yourself.
But, having said that, I do think there's a bit of arrogance in the attitude that you are morally better by not needing guns. I'm sure there are more than a few people in your country who's lives could have been saved by having had the capability of defending themselves.
The term pathetic I used refers to the belief that by passing a law, you somehow make everyone safer. How naive. I guess all the criminals will just stop being criminals because it's against the law.
I guess you'll just have to rely on others to protect you from now on because you have given up the right to do it yourself.
Great Britain, England says...
7:04pm Wed 24 Oct 07
Steve, I am in no way suggesting that we are morally superior because we do not carry guns. If any of my comments lead you to believe that then I too apologise. That is not the intention; I am simply defending my country against a barrage of insults merely because we do not have the same laws as you do in America.
Im sure there are more than a few people in your country whos lives could have been saved by having had the capability of defending themselves. Im quite sure you are right too, however I know that I am right in saying that they wouldnt need to if there were no guns in the hands of those capable of using it for gain or retribution or just plain murder. Plus the fact that there have been many cases where one person has shot someone dead, his friend then goes and shoots the shooter, then his friend, and his, and so on and so on, all under the proviso of somehow being 'disrespected.' So many lives gone (untold innocents too) because people have in their hands a gun. All of that could have been avoided if no one shot anyone in the first place. Lives are being lost on the streets of Britain because people believe they have the right to take a life because they have a gun and that makes them both superior and invincible. Im not saying that is the case in America, Im talking about here. I understand that in America guns have been legal for a very very long time. Thats not the case here. They are relatively new to us and they are causing untold grief to mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, children and friends. Not acceptable. Our laws state that guns are illegal. Thats it. That does not make us superior and nor does it make us inferior. Just different. We do not believe that by passing a law everyone will be safe. That would be rather naïve. However, laws are there to protect people, just as, I assume they are in America. Do you suggest we do away with laws because they do not work? Are you suggesting once the laws have gone, we should arm everyone and let them do it themselves? It would never work. Relying on others to protect us. Hmm. That is what the police force was intended for, is it not? Otherwise, what on earth is the point of having a police force? British people will defend themselves to the best of their ability and within the law, otherwise, we run the risk of falling foul of it and ending up in prison ourselves. But let us also not forget that one of the very first laws on EARTH was thou shall not kill.
As I said the moral superiority comes into play when people call us names because our police force are doing their jobs. Guns are illegal, therefore they will try to do their job in attempting to take them off the streets. We have never given up the right to protect ourselves, we still can and we still do, but we stay within the law, reasonable force. Guns have never been legal here. The way you are talking its as if they were at one point and we have given up that right. Not the case at all. The problems that guns cause us (Britain) today gives credence to the fact that they are illegal and should/will remain so.
Steve, its time for me to bow out, Ive explained/defended as much as I can. I can only suggest that we should agree to disagree, you are not my enemy and I dont wish to make you one. I hope you have a pleasant evening/day (not sure what time it is where you are) and I sincerely hope that you never ever need to use your gun Take care.
Im sure there are more than a few people in your country whos lives could have been saved by having had the capability of defending themselves. Im quite sure you are right too, however I know that I am right in saying that they wouldnt need to if there were no guns in the hands of those capable of using it for gain or retribution or just plain murder. Plus the fact that there have been many cases where one person has shot someone dead, his friend then goes and shoots the shooter, then his friend, and his, and so on and so on, all under the proviso of somehow being 'disrespected.' So many lives gone (untold innocents too) because people have in their hands a gun. All of that could have been avoided if no one shot anyone in the first place. Lives are being lost on the streets of Britain because people believe they have the right to take a life because they have a gun and that makes them both superior and invincible. Im not saying that is the case in America, Im talking about here. I understand that in America guns have been legal for a very very long time. Thats not the case here. They are relatively new to us and they are causing untold grief to mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, children and friends. Not acceptable. Our laws state that guns are illegal. Thats it. That does not make us superior and nor does it make us inferior. Just different. We do not believe that by passing a law everyone will be safe. That would be rather naïve. However, laws are there to protect people, just as, I assume they are in America. Do you suggest we do away with laws because they do not work? Are you suggesting once the laws have gone, we should arm everyone and let them do it themselves? It would never work. Relying on others to protect us. Hmm. That is what the police force was intended for, is it not? Otherwise, what on earth is the point of having a police force? British people will defend themselves to the best of their ability and within the law, otherwise, we run the risk of falling foul of it and ending up in prison ourselves. But let us also not forget that one of the very first laws on EARTH was thou shall not kill.
As I said the moral superiority comes into play when people call us names because our police force are doing their jobs. Guns are illegal, therefore they will try to do their job in attempting to take them off the streets. We have never given up the right to protect ourselves, we still can and we still do, but we stay within the law, reasonable force. Guns have never been legal here. The way you are talking its as if they were at one point and we have given up that right. Not the case at all. The problems that guns cause us (Britain) today gives credence to the fact that they are illegal and should/will remain so.
Steve, its time for me to bow out, Ive explained/defended as much as I can. I can only suggest that we should agree to disagree, you are not my enemy and I dont wish to make you one. I hope you have a pleasant evening/day (not sure what time it is where you are) and I sincerely hope that you never ever need to use your gun Take care.
Steve, U.S.A. says...
10:43pm Wed 24 Oct 07
Well said. Mutual regards for a pleasant morning/afternoon/ev
ening.
ening.
TCK, says...
12:01am Thu 25 Oct 07
What precisely are we giving away? "The right to bear arms?" That never existed in this country dear , we've never been that intent on violence ..
Speaking as a 4th generation Irish-American, I'd like to kindly inform you go go f*** yourself. Then, I'd suggest re-reading you're history books, starting with the Blackstone Commentaries.
To the above; the police WERE NEVER intended to replace the civic duty everyone man has to protect himself, his family, and his community, theres a reason the police were originally unarmed. Furthermore, both in the US, and in Britain, the government has abdicted itself from all responsibly for protecting the individual, what gives them the right to say you can't protect yourself?
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
5:19am Thu 25 Oct 07
Im sure there are more than a few people in your country whos lives could have been saved by having had the capability of defending themselves. Im quite sure you are right too, however I know that I am right in saying that they wouldnt need to if there were no guns in the hands of those capable of using it for gain or retribution or just plain murder.
And just how do you plan to take all the guns away from the criminals? We know how you are doing it to the honest citizens. What is the great master plan to rid the British Isles of firearms and to prevent their re-introduction into your country? Do you think that a law that says that you can't have a gun will stop a criminal from getting one?
Here in Florida as long as you are a law abiding citizen and you have no record of felony convictions or have a restraining order against you for domestic abuse you can most probably get a firearm legally - but if you use it to commit a crime - Show the weapon and its ten years. Use the weapon and its twenty years. Hurt of kill someone with it and its twenty-five to life - if you don't get the needle.
Unless you can go back in time and PREVENT the invention of gunpowder and firearms, they will always be a part of society. Don't forget, that before guns and gunpowder, sticks and rocks were used to commit murder and mayhem long before there were even knives.
You are going about this all wrong. You need to remove the 'want' to do harm from people, not the 'how'. And until you can do that, the criminals in society will always prey on the civilized.
I can assure you that it will be a cold day in hell before my government takes my weapons from me without cause or justification. Me and about 100,000 million others.
Incidently, just for statistical purposes, police officers commit more unjustified killings than licensed gun holders in this country. So by your standards, we should de-arm our police officers and just hope for the best.
A Passer By, London says...
11:05am Thu 25 Oct 07
TCK wrote:And I suggest you acquire some manners and forgo the foul mouthed insults....
What precisely are we giving away? "The right to bear arms?" That never existed in this country dear , we've never been that intent on violence ..Speaking as a 4th generation Irish-American, I'd like to kindly inform you go go f*** yourself. Then, I'd suggest re-reading you're history books, starting with the Blackstone Commentaries. To the above; the police WERE NEVER intended to replace the civic duty everyone man has to protect himself, his family, and his community, theres a reason the police were originally unarmed. Furthermore, both in the US, and in Britain, the government has abdicted itself from all responsibly for protecting the individual, what gives them the right to say you can't protect yourself?
The Blackstone Commentaries.. Do you mean? "The influential 18th century treatise on the common law of England by Sir William Blackstone.."
It may surprise you to know that I am not over 400 years old...
I trust you are not suggesting that I am to be held responsible for the decisions and actions of the British forefathers, because if you are, boy do you have some amendments to make too.... My comment referred to now, our time.
And who said anything about the Police replacing civic duty?? No one on this site has.. The fact remains, even on your police cars it states 'to protect and serve.' That is their job despite our 'civil duties.' Most of our police are still unarmed, there are only one section (SO19) who are our armed response...
No one has told us we can't protect ourselves, as Great Britain said, we can and we do, within OUR law, and within reasonable force. Our law does not permit us to blow someone's brains out because they try to steal our car...
BarnacleBob, Sadly, England says...
1:46pm Thu 25 Oct 07
This is getting beyond a joke, I'm scared, genuinely scared. For my children, what kind of country am I leaving them in......
another collector, England says...
3:07pm Thu 25 Oct 07
What a load of mis-informed people there are, its not the police who determine if a replica can be converted or not, there are tests carried out by the home office to confirm this.
Those blank firing guns have hardened carbide steel cast into the barrel, the rest of it is made from weak metal, any attempts to covert it to use live rounds will result in it exploding.
We never had the right to bear arms? Someone needs to check things before posting !!, section 7 of our 1689 Bill of Rights gives us the "RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS FOR DEFENCE", this is a statute law and NO government can take it away, therefore it still exists today, we just can't arm ourselves with firearms.
Those blank firing guns have hardened carbide steel cast into the barrel, the rest of it is made from weak metal, any attempts to covert it to use live rounds will result in it exploding.
We never had the right to bear arms? Someone needs to check things before posting !!, section 7 of our 1689 Bill of Rights gives us the "RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS FOR DEFENCE", this is a statute law and NO government can take it away, therefore it still exists today, we just can't arm ourselves with firearms.
AntiGunToo, London says...
3:14pm Thu 25 Oct 07
"The Met said in a statement that "although there was no concern that the owner of the collection posed a threat himself, the firearms that had been identified by officers as susceptible to conversion were retained as a precautionary measure" and will be destroyed."
We never had the right to bear arms? Someone needs to check things before posting !!, section 7 of our 1689 Bill of Rights gives us the "RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS FOR DEFENCE", this is a statute law and NO government can take it away, therefore it still exists today, we just can't arm ourselves with firearms.
They don't really need to check that before posting, this story relates to guns, therefore I understood the posts to be about guns.. Plus the fact that when you talk about 'arms' I relate that to firearms.. So are you saying it ok to arm ourselves with knives then? For defence of course!
Absolute madness.
We never had the right to bear arms? Someone needs to check things before posting !!, section 7 of our 1689 Bill of Rights gives us the "RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS FOR DEFENCE", this is a statute law and NO government can take it away, therefore it still exists today, we just can't arm ourselves with firearms.
They don't really need to check that before posting, this story relates to guns, therefore I understood the posts to be about guns.. Plus the fact that when you talk about 'arms' I relate that to firearms.. So are you saying it ok to arm ourselves with knives then? For defence of course!
Absolute madness.
another collector, England says...
3:26pm Thu 25 Oct 07
Great Britain said
Sorry but where did this come from? Guns are still legal here but you need a section 1 FAC to hold one. Pistols are illegal unless you hold a section 5 FAC issued by the Home Office and these are normally as a PPW (Personal protect weapon) which means they are being carried around on the streets, rumour has it that Robin Cooke (the TV reporter)has one.
Guns have never been legal here
Sorry but where did this come from? Guns are still legal here but you need a section 1 FAC to hold one. Pistols are illegal unless you hold a section 5 FAC issued by the Home Office and these are normally as a PPW (Personal protect weapon) which means they are being carried around on the streets, rumour has it that Robin Cooke (the TV reporter)has one.
AntiGunToo, London says...
3:31pm Thu 25 Oct 07
Thought I would look up re the 1689 Bill of Rights and all I could find was a "Report of the ACT Bill of Rights Consultative Comittee"
and it said "On the other hand, the Bill of Rights also contains various outmoded and discrimatory provisions. It mirrors the anti-Catholic bias of its era, for example confining the right to bear arms for defence to Protestants."
"Another collector" as you appear to know the 1689 Bill of rights so well, is that correct?
Obviously if it is true, then that bill does not apply to everyone in Great Britain, correct? So then the person you advised to do some research before they posted, possibly didn't need to after all?
and it said "On the other hand, the Bill of Rights also contains various outmoded and discrimatory provisions. It mirrors the anti-Catholic bias of its era, for example confining the right to bear arms for defence to Protestants."
"Another collector" as you appear to know the 1689 Bill of rights so well, is that correct?
Obviously if it is true, then that bill does not apply to everyone in Great Britain, correct? So then the person you advised to do some research before they posted, possibly didn't need to after all?
AntiGunToo, London says...
3:45pm Thu 25 Oct 07
another collector wrote:You are quite correct. Still, the majority of people in GB do not hold these, correct?
Great Britain saidGuns have never been legal hereSorry but where did this come from? Guns are still legal here but you need a section 1 FAC to hold one. Pistols are illegal unless you hold a section 5 FAC issued by the Home Office and these are normally as a PPW (Personal protect weapon) which means they are being carried around on the streets, rumour has it that Robin Cooke (the TV reporter)has one.
This is very interesting, found the following also:
"The right to keep and bear arms had originated in England during the reign of Henry II with the 1181 Assize of Arms, and developed as part of Common Law. These rights no longer exist in the UK, since the UK's doctrine of Parliamentary sovereignty allows the repeal of previous laws with no enshrined exceptions such as contained within a codified constitution."
C.J, Wales says...
4:03pm Thu 25 Oct 07
Were there any REAL weapons found in this gentleman's possession or only replicas?
There weren't any found at all, were there?
Whilst I appreciate the fact that the sale of Replica Imitation Firearms is no longer permitted in the UK since the VCRA was enforced on 1st October 2007, ownership and use of Replicas and Toy guns bought before that date is perfectly legal.
Further to that, if the gentleman has legitimate reasons for owning Replicas then the Home Office has agreed exemptions to the Law.
From what I read, this gentleman has done absolutely nothing illegal, no crime has been committed.
If the Police found REAL weapons kept illegally, or did indeed find "easily convertable" weapons in this Gentleman's possession then there may be a case to answer but, as far as I am aware, there are definately no Replica Immitation Firearms available that can possibly be converted to fire live ammunition. Plastics, ABS and zinc will not withstand the pressures generated by fired bullets. The toy gun would most probably blow up in the holder's hands.
Of the Replicas found, were any of the completely harmless and legally owned toys handed back to their owner or did the Police take the lot regardless?
I find it rather bewildering that thugs roam our streets selling drugs openly and indeed shooting each other with REAL guns seemingly at will but a collector of harmless replicas who doesn'tappear to have broken any Law at all suffers the full brunt of the Police.
What is this Country coming too?
There weren't any found at all, were there?
Whilst I appreciate the fact that the sale of Replica Imitation Firearms is no longer permitted in the UK since the VCRA was enforced on 1st October 2007, ownership and use of Replicas and Toy guns bought before that date is perfectly legal.
Further to that, if the gentleman has legitimate reasons for owning Replicas then the Home Office has agreed exemptions to the Law.
From what I read, this gentleman has done absolutely nothing illegal, no crime has been committed.
If the Police found REAL weapons kept illegally, or did indeed find "easily convertable" weapons in this Gentleman's possession then there may be a case to answer but, as far as I am aware, there are definately no Replica Immitation Firearms available that can possibly be converted to fire live ammunition. Plastics, ABS and zinc will not withstand the pressures generated by fired bullets. The toy gun would most probably blow up in the holder's hands.
Of the Replicas found, were any of the completely harmless and legally owned toys handed back to their owner or did the Police take the lot regardless?
I find it rather bewildering that thugs roam our streets selling drugs openly and indeed shooting each other with REAL guns seemingly at will but a collector of harmless replicas who doesn'tappear to have broken any Law at all suffers the full brunt of the Police.
What is this Country coming too?
Jim, lanarkshire says...
5:39pm Thu 25 Oct 07
this is utter crap by the police force in question
this gentleman has done nothing wrong
he did not have them in a public place
he was not using them in a threatning manner
he was entitled to own these prior to the vcr bill coming out on the 1st october.
the police are at fault here I would gladly fight this all the way
THE POLICE ARE IN THE WRONG 100%
this gentleman has done nothing wrong
he did not have them in a public place
he was not using them in a threatning manner
he was entitled to own these prior to the vcr bill coming out on the 1st october.
the police are at fault here I would gladly fight this all the way
THE POLICE ARE IN THE WRONG 100%
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
6:06pm Thu 25 Oct 07
quoteOur law does not permit us to blow someone's brains out because they try to steal our car...
What if they try to kill you, rape your wife or child, kidnapp your child, enter you house in the middle of the night to do bodily harm or steal from you, rob you at knife point, etc...
I have found that police are a REACTIONARY FORCE. This means that they aren't there until AFTER the crime has been commited. Who protects you when the police aren't there?
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
10:24am Fri 26 Oct 07
Ok, first of all I would like to point out something. When you Americans, yes, the earliest and the latest comments, decide to insult the British, maybe first you should take a look at your own country. Yes, we all can admit that there is something wrong with Britain, but isn't that with every country? In comparison, Britain has had less gun deaths than America in proportion to population. Because guns are illegal. Now, some of you say that many lives could be saved if British citizens had the guns to defend themselves. But so many more would be killed if it was legalized. Remember, more people who die in gun fatalities are killed by their own guns. Despite my argument, I am glad to have America as such an ally as they are. This man was in no way breaking the law, but he was in no way being accused of anything. His replica guns, which were a threat because they could be turned into real guns to fire ammunition, were seized because if they fell into the wrong hands then people may die.
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
10:28am Fri 26 Oct 07
Ok, first of all I would like to point out something. When you Americans, yes, the earliest and the latest comments, decide to insult the British, maybe first you should take a look at your own country. Yes, we all can admit that there is something wrong with Britain, but isn't that with every country? In comparison, Britain has had less gun deaths than America in proportion to population. Because guns are illegal. Now, some of you say that many lives could be saved if British citizens had the guns to defend themselves. But so many more would be killed if it was legalized. Remember, more people who die in gun fatalities are killed by their own guns. Despite my argument, I am glad to have America as such an ally as they are. This man was in no way breaking the law, but he was in no way being accused of anything. His replica guns, which were a threat because they could be turned into real guns to fire ammunition, were seized because if they fell into the wrong hands then people may die.
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
10:29am Fri 26 Oct 07
Ok, first of all I would like to point out something. When you Americans, yes, the earliest and the latest comments, decide to insult the British, maybe first you should take a look at your own country. Yes, we all can admit that there is something wrong with Britain, but isn't that with every country? In comparison, Britain has had less gun deaths than America in proportion to population. Because guns are illegal. Now, some of you say that many lives could be saved if British citizens had the guns to defend themselves. But so many more would be killed if it was legalized. Remember, more people who die in gun fatalities are killed by their own guns. Despite my argument, I am glad to have America as such an ally as they are. This man was in no way breaking the law, but he was in no way being accused of anything. His replica guns, which were a threat because they could be turned into real guns to fire ammunition, were seized because if they fell into the wrong hands then people may die.
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called 'liberty' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East.
And to you, "bloke across the fish pond", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Robert Todd, scotland says...
9:55pm Sat 27 Oct 07
So what is it that you are saying exactly? That you feel that it is your right to make an armed raid on the home of every law abiding citizen in the land who legaly owns something that you dont like? you are sayng that you wish to be allowed to get away with armed robbery? for that is exactly what this is!This man did nothing wrong,possesed nothing illeagal, and by all accounts behaved with impecable restraint Was he compensated for the theaft of his collection? Was it suggested that though the law of the land (which the police are supposed to uphold not write)did not demand it; that he might keep his collection in a safe? Did these armed crimminals sieze his motor vehicle lest some roaming lowlife steal it and use it to commit a crime? Afterall motor cars kill and seriously injure an awfull lot of people every year, Way more than even real guns! Or perhapse empty the mans Kitchen drawer of all its sharp bits!!?I hope that he Phones a decent Qc! these sad appologies for police officers have scared the wits out of and killed a number of inocents in recent years by a combination of cowardice, stupidity, ignorance, hysteria, bad behaviour and just plain crimminal murder! and done it in full view of a gobsmacked puplic. These people are themselves criminals and should be locked up!I know this, a nations police force should not be the enemy of its law abiding citizens! These people are, and I don't trust them! agree that Ammerica is generaly held to be a nation of arseholes, but on this point they are right. If this peacefull, law abiding citizen cannot live in peace with his possesions knowing that his right to do so is as protected as anyone ellses
then this once proud country is indeed as sad and uslesly broken as the spirit of those who would have the protection of such a corrupt police state.
then this once proud country is indeed as sad and uslesly broken as the spirit of those who would have the protection of such a corrupt police state.
YOB, LONDON TOWN says...
4:52pm Sun 28 Oct 07
Great Britain wrote:GUNS ARE LEGAL IN UK U **** ****!! THE ONLY GUNS OUTLAWED ARE: MOST HANGUNS (NOT ALL AS SOME PEOPLE THINK) FULL-AUTO AND BURST FIRE, SMI-AUTO CENTRE FIRE RIFLES, SOME AIRGUNS, ALL THE REST REQUIES A BULLOCKS LIENSE. IF U THINK I AM LIEING REAL THE FIREARMS ACT 1968 TO 1997 YOU DAILY MAIL **** READER ****
Guns are illegal in this country, whether they take it away from an old man or not makes no difference whatsoever..
Who is scared of \'Americans with snide comments\' certainly not me. Your comments do me no harm whatsoever Although considering your answer to anything is to shoot it I probably should be..
\"I\'m not really scared of anything you have to threaten me with, though\"
Now you see? That is where we differ, I don\'t feel the need to threaten anyone, I do not think I am bigger and better than I am . We don\'t need guns, real or toy to prove ourselves.
WOG, says...
4:54pm Sun 28 Oct 07
HEY **** WAT U SAYING
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
7:58pm Sun 28 Oct 07
Andrew wrote:Andrew:
Ok, first of all I would like to point out something. When you Americans, yes, the earliest and the latest comments, decide to insult the British, maybe first you should take a look at your own country. Yes, we all can admit that there is something wrong with Britain, but isn\'t that with every country? In comparison, Britain has had less gun deaths than America in proportion to population. Because guns are illegal. Now, some of you say that many lives could be saved if British citizens had the guns to defend themselves. But so many more would be killed if it was legalized. Remember, more people who die in gun fatalities are killed by their own guns. Despite my argument, I am glad to have America as such an ally as they are. This man was in no way breaking the law, but he was in no way being accused of anything. His replica guns, which were a threat because they could be turned into real guns to fire ammunition, were seized because if they fell into the wrong hands then people may die. Before you Americans judge us about how our country has disgraced itself, look at your own. Your so called \'liberty\' has turned into utter racism, your ideals now trapped in the fingers of manic congressman, and an oil crazed President licking his lips while looking at the Middle East. And to you, \"bloke across the fish pond\", do you expect the police to be at your house the moment you click your fingers? We are only human. We all have faults...
Liberty into racism? Ideals trapped in the finger of manic congressman? An oil crazed president licking his lips....
These statement are laughable and do not even justify a civilized response. They are way off topic anyways.
No I DO NOT count on the police to protect me. There are not enough of them in todays society to do their jobs adequatly. Be it in my country OR yours. Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries (what is it now, 45% and more) in taxes for the 'pviviledge' of having your police protect you - but it is not working because your country is still rampant with crime and criminals.
I protect myself and my own. And I do it within the laws and legal statutes of my country.
This also is not the point.
Armed police raiding a law abiding citizens house because of what MIGHT happen if a criminal stole his property to use it nefariously. He legally owned this private property. Whats next? Your car because someone MIGHT steal it and use it to run someone over? How about your cricket bat? Maybe your steak knife. What about that meter long steel rod in your machine shop that MIGHT be used to make a rifle barrel. Hell, not even a rifle barrel - but just MIGHT be used as is by a criminal for nefarious actions.
Most of these items he was pressured to surrendered were TOYS. The few that were not toys were no danger to society. Just because it MIGHT be used or modified by a criminal should not make it illegal to own and he should NOT have been RAIDED/INVADED by ARMED POLICE and had his legal RIGHTS to own these items circumvented. This man had the LEGAL RIGHT to have these items.
Croyboy, Croydon says...
8:19am Mon 29 Oct 07
"Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries..."
"Empire"?! Might I suggest you buy a history book published post-WWII?
Apart from that, Bloke across the Pond, I understand and agree with a lot of what you say. ...And so do a great many of my fellow Englishman, I'm sure.
"Empire"?! Might I suggest you buy a history book published post-WWII?
Apart from that, Bloke across the Pond, I understand and agree with a lot of what you say. ...And so do a great many of my fellow Englishman, I'm sure.
Daily Mail Reader, London says...
10:37am Mon 29 Oct 07
YOB wrote:"GUNS ARE LEGAL IN UK U **** ****!!"
Great Britain wrote: Guns are illegal in this country, whether they take it away from an old man or not makes no difference whatsoever.. Who is scared of \'Americans with snide comments\' certainly not me. Your comments do me no harm whatsoever Although considering your answer to anything is to shoot it I probably should be.. \"I\'m not really scared of anything you have to threaten me with, though\" Now you see? That is where we differ, I don\'t feel the need to threaten anyone, I do not think I am bigger and better than I am . We don\'t need guns, real or toy to prove ourselves.GUNS ARE LEGAL IN UK U **** ****!! THE ONLY GUNS OUTLAWED ARE: MOST HANGUNS (NOT ALL AS SOME PEOPLE THINK) FULL-AUTO AND BURST FIRE, SMI-AUTO CENTRE FIRE RIFLES, SOME AIRGUNS, ALL THE REST REQUIES A BULLOCKS LIENSE. IF U THINK I AM LIEING REAL THE FIREARMS ACT 1968 TO 1997 YOU DAILY MAIL **** READER ****
Nice.
If you do not have a license but have a gun, is your gun legal or illegal?
"ALL THE REST REQUIES A BULLOCKS LIENSE."
License
"IF U THINK I AM LIEING REAL THE FIREARMS ACT"
Lying. Read.
I would suggest that you re-read what you type and obtain a dictionary before posting...
Grover, Missouri says...
4:13pm Mon 29 Oct 07
If you outlaw guns...only outlaws will have guns.
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
7:29pm Mon 29 Oct 07
Croyboy wrote:I apologize for the use of the term 'Empire' and hope that I did not cause offense by utilizing it.
"Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries..." "Empire"?! Might I suggest you buy a history book published post-WWII? Apart from that, Bloke across the Pond, I understand and agree with a lot of what you say. ...And so do a great many of my fellow Englishman, I'm sure.
I guess a more appropriate term would be British Isles, Great Britain, or simply Englishmen as you suggested.
Thanks for pointing that out.
Croyboy, says...
8:07am Wed 31 Oct 07
No apologies necessary, and certainly no offence taken: things were a lot better organised and large numbers of people in the Third World were far better off when we had an empire. Just ask them (privately). Otherwise, why on earth should so many of them want to forsake their "free" countries and come here?
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
8:53am Wed 31 Oct 07
Bloke across the pond:
No I DO NOT count on the police to protect me. There are not enough of them in todays society to do their jobs adequatly. Be it in my country OR yours. Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries (what is it now, 45% and more) in taxes for the 'pviviledge' of having your police protect you - but it is not working because your country is still rampant with crime and criminals.
1. No country is perfect. We can't throw a load of money into the hole and hope all our criminals are gone. It just doesn't work like that.
2. Who catches these criminals? A bunch of village folk could not. And if you just pulled up the police and demobilized them, all would turn to chaos. I am proud and feel safe to have a Police Force around me, protecting me.
So say what you like, try to prove your point, but to me, Britain will always be Great.
No I DO NOT count on the police to protect me. There are not enough of them in todays society to do their jobs adequatly. Be it in my country OR yours. Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries (what is it now, 45% and more) in taxes for the 'pviviledge' of having your police protect you - but it is not working because your country is still rampant with crime and criminals.
1. No country is perfect. We can't throw a load of money into the hole and hope all our criminals are gone. It just doesn't work like that.
2. Who catches these criminals? A bunch of village folk could not. And if you just pulled up the police and demobilized them, all would turn to chaos. I am proud and feel safe to have a Police Force around me, protecting me.
So say what you like, try to prove your point, but to me, Britain will always be Great.
LC, London says...
1:59pm Wed 31 Oct 07
Croyboy wrote:"Otherwise, why on earth should so many of them want to forsake their "free" countries and come here?"
No apologies necessary, and certainly no offence taken: things were a lot better organised and large numbers of people in the Third World were far better off when we had an empire. Just ask them (privately). Otherwise, why on earth should so many of them want to forsake their "free" countries and come here?
You really can't help yourself can you?
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
9:03pm Thu 1 Nov 07
1. No country is perfect. We can't throw a load of money into the hole and hope all our criminals are gone. It just doesn't work like that.
2. Who catches these criminals? A bunch of village folk could not. And if you just pulled up the police and demobilized them, all would turn to chaos. I am proud and feel safe to have a Police Force around me, protecting me.
So say what you like, try to prove your point, but to me, Britain will always be Great
These so called police officers used armed force to enter this
inocent peacefull law abiding citizens home and then illeagaly remove his leagaly held posessions!
in other words they simply stole his property! This is by definition theft and in this case armed theft or robbery!
the reason that we have a police force is so that laws protecting an individuals right to live in peace
with his leagaly held posessions are inforced! The behavior of these so called police officers was wholly contrary to this principal
That a police force is a nessisary evil is not in doubt, a nation needs a means of enforcing laws, but no self respecting individual
or nation should be asked or be willing to put up with this outrage,these people steal the name and respect from every decent
police officer in the land!!
If a peaceful law abiding citizen cannot live in peace knowing that he and his legaly held possesions are as protected as anyone
ellses then we are in deep trouble and a very dangerous precedent has already been set
If these characters have no regard for the law, and this is clearly the case,
for they break it with impunity. then why would your unlawfully armed
lowlife feel that they should have any more respect for the law or the rights of his fellow man than the so called police?
in times gone buy if a police officer was found guilty of breaking the very laws that he was supposed to uphold,
then the penalty for this breach of trust and possition was eaven greater! and rightly so!!
these bloody people just hunted down, shot and killed an inocent man in my country in broad daylight
then lied and lied and lied about it from the wretch who pulled the trigger to the low life Ian B'liar who made the bloody lies up!!!
They aught to be brought up and charged with these offences and if found guilty punished accordingly
they are a disgrace to themselves, the police force, they represent, the laws they are supposed to be upholding and the people of this country!!
and for you or anyone else to attempt to justify the behaviour of these,,,wreches, is an apalling indictment on you
You are a shameless coward and deserve all the benefits that only a truly corrupt, armed and principless
police force can bring you and those like you, No decent man would surrender his right to peace
and liberty for the protective shackles of a bloody armed ned,
beleive you me the people who put the great into britain wouldn't even look at you
2. Who catches these criminals? A bunch of village folk could not. And if you just pulled up the police and demobilized them, all would turn to chaos. I am proud and feel safe to have a Police Force around me, protecting me.
So say what you like, try to prove your point, but to me, Britain will always be Great
These so called police officers used armed force to enter this
inocent peacefull law abiding citizens home and then illeagaly remove his leagaly held posessions!
in other words they simply stole his property! This is by definition theft and in this case armed theft or robbery!
the reason that we have a police force is so that laws protecting an individuals right to live in peace
with his leagaly held posessions are inforced! The behavior of these so called police officers was wholly contrary to this principal
That a police force is a nessisary evil is not in doubt, a nation needs a means of enforcing laws, but no self respecting individual
or nation should be asked or be willing to put up with this outrage,these people steal the name and respect from every decent
police officer in the land!!
If a peaceful law abiding citizen cannot live in peace knowing that he and his legaly held possesions are as protected as anyone
ellses then we are in deep trouble and a very dangerous precedent has already been set
If these characters have no regard for the law, and this is clearly the case,
for they break it with impunity. then why would your unlawfully armed
lowlife feel that they should have any more respect for the law or the rights of his fellow man than the so called police?
in times gone buy if a police officer was found guilty of breaking the very laws that he was supposed to uphold,
then the penalty for this breach of trust and possition was eaven greater! and rightly so!!
these bloody people just hunted down, shot and killed an inocent man in my country in broad daylight
then lied and lied and lied about it from the wretch who pulled the trigger to the low life Ian B'liar who made the bloody lies up!!!
They aught to be brought up and charged with these offences and if found guilty punished accordingly
they are a disgrace to themselves, the police force, they represent, the laws they are supposed to be upholding and the people of this country!!
and for you or anyone else to attempt to justify the behaviour of these,,,wreches, is an apalling indictment on you
You are a shameless coward and deserve all the benefits that only a truly corrupt, armed and principless
police force can bring you and those like you, No decent man would surrender his right to peace
and liberty for the protective shackles of a bloody armed ned,
beleive you me the people who put the great into britain wouldn't even look at you
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
11:44pm Thu 1 Nov 07
Now calm down Sir there is no need for personal attacks. If you truly want to I suggest you improve your spelling. I am certainly not mitigating the fact of armed theft committed by the police, and I would say I don't agree with it. But I am defending the right to have a Police force. The reason we have a Police force is to catch criminals and keep the peace in a country. What you are saying is that we should take away the Police. This is a ridiculous idea. Abolishing the police is ridiculous because a nation without law enforcement would crumble into chaos. Let me get this point clear to ALL debating against me. I DO NOT agree with what the Police did in the instance, but it is still a gey area. Thee are so many consuquences of NOT doing it, and also proceeding with it. In this particular case, I do not think there was any need for it, but in the end we, the people, have half a say of what goes in and out.
And Mr Todd, I would rather you didn't make personal attacks against me or my English beliefs, because an accusation directed towards me is weak and uneccesay. If you have to continue, learn to spell. Please. For all of us.
And Mr Todd, I would rather you didn't make personal attacks against me or my English beliefs, because an accusation directed towards me is weak and uneccesay. If you have to continue, learn to spell. Please. For all of us.
Bloke across the Pond, Florida USA says...
2:40am Fri 2 Nov 07
Andrew wrote:Andrew:
Bloke across the pond: No I DO NOT count on the police to protect me. There are not enough of them in todays society to do their jobs adequatly. Be it in my country OR yours. Citizens in the British Empire pay a substantial amount of salaries (what is it now, 45% and more) in taxes for the \'pviviledge\' of having your police protect you - but it is not working because your country is still rampant with crime and criminals. 1. No country is perfect. We can\'t throw a load of money into the hole and hope all our criminals are gone. It just doesn\'t work like that. 2. Who catches these criminals? A bunch of village folk could not. And if you just pulled up the police and demobilized them, all would turn to chaos. I am proud and feel safe to have a Police Force around me, protecting me. So say what you like, try to prove your point, but to me, Britain will always be Great.
Do not misread my statement or its meaning.
I DO think that we need a police force to enforce the laws. I just DO NOT count on them when the need arises (except to write reports about crimes - after the fact).
Where were they when my house was burgled and my items stolen? Nowhere to be found until it came time to write the report of the crime.
Where were they when my neighbours house was burgled? Nowhere to be found until after the fact and of course to fill out the report.
Where were they when our local bank was robbed three times by armed robbers? Not to be found until it came time to write the report.
It's not their fault. There are just not enough of them so I do not count on them anymore to protect me or my family against criminals. And I certainly will not continue to 'dump money into a broken system' in the hopes that it will get better.
All I am stating is that I DO NOT count on the police to be there for me until after the crime has been commited - much too late, and I am not willing to take that chance.
But let me make myself perfectly clear on this matter in reference to this mans property:
The police were criminal in invading this persons home(armed and in great numbers)and they basically stole his rightfully owned property because his neighbours thought that a criminal, in some future time, MIGHT steal his toys and use them nefariously.
Now granted, there are differences in the laws of your country and mine, but last I heard police taking legally owned property is WRONG and ILLEGAL in either one of our respected countries, regardless of what MIGHT occur in the future.
And come on now, even the police refered to these items as replicas that posed no harm to the community.
Was the man a threat? - No
Were the replicas a threat? - No
Were laws being broken? - No
It is a sad state of affairs when a neighbour 'squeals' on a law abiding citizen and the result is: "This action was taken to pro-actively reduce the threat of firearm incidents in the borough and to prevent any possible tragic consequences should they have made their way into the wrong hands". They are not even firearms, they are legally colletable replicas OF firearms.
Give me a break here Andrew - even you know that this is wrong - and if you don't, then maybe you DO deserve to have your rights pro-actively violated as the police see fit without justify-able cause.
This goes much further than just replica guns and if you can not see this - or are willing to accept it - then you deserve all that you get when they come to take YOUR rightfully owned property because a neighbour is 'nervous'.
And yes, I too beleive that Britain will ALWAYS be Great. But it is only as great as the people REQUIRE it to be.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
11:30am Fri 2 Nov 07
You are absolutely right Andrew; my spelling is atrocious! Here is an edited version so that you can actually read what it is that I tried to say!
These so called police officers used armed force to enter this
inocent peaceful law abiding citizens home and then illegally remove his legally held possessions!
In other words they simply stole his property! This is by definition theft and in this case armed theft or robbery!
The reason that we have a police force is so that laws protecting an individuals right to live in peace
with his legally held possessions are enforced! The behaviour of these so called police officers was wholly contrary to this principal
That a police force is a necessary evil is not in doubt, a nation needs a means of enforcing laws, but no self respecting individual
or nation should be asked or be willing to put up with this outrage, these people steal the name and respect from every decent police officer in the land!!
If a peaceful law abiding citizen cannot live in peace knowing that he and his legally held possessions are as protected as anyone elses then we are in deep trouble and a very
dangerous precedent has already been set.
If these characters have no regard for the law, and this is clearly the case,
for they break it with impunity. Then why would, unlawfully armed
lowlife feel that they should have any more respect for the law or the rights of his fellow man than the so called police?
In times gone buy if a police officer was found guilty of breaking the very laws that he was supposed to uphold,
then the penalty for this breach of trust and position was even greater! and rightly so!!
these bloody people just hunted down, shot and killed an innocent man in my country in broad daylight
then lied and lied and lied about it from the wretch who pulled the trigger to the low life Ian B'liar who made the bloody lies up!!!
They aught to be brought up on charges with these offences and when found guilty punished accordingly.
They are a disgrace to themselves, the police force, they represent, the laws they are supposed to be upholding and the people of this country!!
And for you or anyone else to attempt to justify the behaviour of these,,, wreches, is an appalling indictment on you.
You are a shameless coward and deserve all the benefits that only a truly corrupt, armed and principle less police force can bring you and those like you. No decent man would surrender his right to peace and liberty for the protective shackles of a bloody armed ned.
Believe you me, the people who put the great into Britain wouldn't even look at you. And they certainly wouldnt be tolerating the behaviour of these conceited, patronising, gun totting pompous lowlife!! Theyd have charged them with murder, armed robbery, perverting the course of justice and dealt with them accordingly.
These so called police officers used armed force to enter this
inocent peaceful law abiding citizens home and then illegally remove his legally held possessions!
In other words they simply stole his property! This is by definition theft and in this case armed theft or robbery!
The reason that we have a police force is so that laws protecting an individuals right to live in peace
with his legally held possessions are enforced! The behaviour of these so called police officers was wholly contrary to this principal
That a police force is a necessary evil is not in doubt, a nation needs a means of enforcing laws, but no self respecting individual
or nation should be asked or be willing to put up with this outrage, these people steal the name and respect from every decent police officer in the land!!
If a peaceful law abiding citizen cannot live in peace knowing that he and his legally held possessions are as protected as anyone elses then we are in deep trouble and a very
dangerous precedent has already been set.
If these characters have no regard for the law, and this is clearly the case,
for they break it with impunity. Then why would, unlawfully armed
lowlife feel that they should have any more respect for the law or the rights of his fellow man than the so called police?
In times gone buy if a police officer was found guilty of breaking the very laws that he was supposed to uphold,
then the penalty for this breach of trust and position was even greater! and rightly so!!
these bloody people just hunted down, shot and killed an innocent man in my country in broad daylight
then lied and lied and lied about it from the wretch who pulled the trigger to the low life Ian B'liar who made the bloody lies up!!!
They aught to be brought up on charges with these offences and when found guilty punished accordingly.
They are a disgrace to themselves, the police force, they represent, the laws they are supposed to be upholding and the people of this country!!
And for you or anyone else to attempt to justify the behaviour of these,,, wreches, is an appalling indictment on you.
You are a shameless coward and deserve all the benefits that only a truly corrupt, armed and principle less police force can bring you and those like you. No decent man would surrender his right to peace and liberty for the protective shackles of a bloody armed ned.
Believe you me, the people who put the great into Britain wouldn't even look at you. And they certainly wouldnt be tolerating the behaviour of these conceited, patronising, gun totting pompous lowlife!! Theyd have charged them with murder, armed robbery, perverting the course of justice and dealt with them accordingly.
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
12:56pm Fri 2 Nov 07
For the first part, Blocke across the Pond, I agree with you. I do not count on the Police to protect me from harm. Yet it is not their fault. We are only human. But don't get me wrong, if I was being burgled, I would rather prevent it than wait for the Police to come, by the time he had gone.
As I have said before, I do think this was wong. It shouldn't have been done, but I am disputing the fact that so many Americans ae bad mouthing England as a county for 1 incident. I do not think the Police should have raided his house, I was merely explaining why I thought they had the idea to raid his house.
And Robert, I find your personal attacks to me as a debater immature and weak. You have no right to name call me as a person, for something I believe. This does not achieve anything. In future, I hope you learn to direct your 'attacks' on the subject rather than the person. Please do not sink that low as to carry on with this.
As I have said before, I do think this was wong. It shouldn't have been done, but I am disputing the fact that so many Americans ae bad mouthing England as a county for 1 incident. I do not think the Police should have raided his house, I was merely explaining why I thought they had the idea to raid his house.
And Robert, I find your personal attacks to me as a debater immature and weak. You have no right to name call me as a person, for something I believe. This does not achieve anything. In future, I hope you learn to direct your 'attacks' on the subject rather than the person. Please do not sink that low as to carry on with this.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
6:49pm Fri 2 Nov 07
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace.
We ask not your counsels or arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen
We ask not your counsels or arms.
Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
9:27pm Tue 6 Nov 07
Am I hallucinating or something or are you trying to throw a scottish attack on the British? I suspected this from the start.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
6:41pm Wed 7 Nov 07
Yes Andrew you are hallucinating or something!
And I strongly suspect that it's because you're a
Mental case rather than a drug addict!
for the record if you had read or understood anything
that I wrote in response to your ridiculous outpourings
you'd have elucidadated the fact that
I too believe that a nation requires a police force.
but it requires one that obeys the laws that it is
supposed to be upholding. they are not supposed to write
laws to suit themselves, or abuse those written by others,
or the people that they are supposed to serve, And again I'll say
(as you clearly missed it the first time round)
A nations police force is not supposed to be the enemy
of its peacefull, law abiding citizens, and this so called
police force has proved itself not once (as you wrote)
but many hundreds of times, to be just that,
every other week we here of these wretches
attempting to incite hysteria over some mindless drivel or other,
if it's not some wee boy having his toy removed at gunpoint
by some campaigning bimbo in a police uniform, then it's some
innocent or other being arrested for daring to speak
in public within a mile of B'liars lair,
for my part I'm heartily sick of it and those of you
who passively support the outrageous behaviour of these degenerates
and while Im on my soap box Ill tell you another thing
I happen to believe very much in Britain which is why I'm
not about to sit about and say nothing when I see or hear
of it or its people being abused by the likes of you!
Or these so called police.
and another thing,
I happen to have served this country as a soldier In a Scottish regiment
of the British army for six years, my father served as a soldier
in the Duke of wellingtons light infantry, and the Royal engineers,
My mother served as a signals officer in the RAF,
I have no end of respect for the crown, this country and the Royal family,
and unlike you will defend it to the death if needs be!!
I happen to be one of the people who daily makes an effort to maintain the
"Great" in Great Britain, despite the efforts of these gangsters and likes of you!!
And I strongly suspect that it's because you're a
Mental case rather than a drug addict!
for the record if you had read or understood anything
that I wrote in response to your ridiculous outpourings
you'd have elucidadated the fact that
I too believe that a nation requires a police force.
but it requires one that obeys the laws that it is
supposed to be upholding. they are not supposed to write
laws to suit themselves, or abuse those written by others,
or the people that they are supposed to serve, And again I'll say
(as you clearly missed it the first time round)
A nations police force is not supposed to be the enemy
of its peacefull, law abiding citizens, and this so called
police force has proved itself not once (as you wrote)
but many hundreds of times, to be just that,
every other week we here of these wretches
attempting to incite hysteria over some mindless drivel or other,
if it's not some wee boy having his toy removed at gunpoint
by some campaigning bimbo in a police uniform, then it's some
innocent or other being arrested for daring to speak
in public within a mile of B'liars lair,
for my part I'm heartily sick of it and those of you
who passively support the outrageous behaviour of these degenerates
and while Im on my soap box Ill tell you another thing
I happen to believe very much in Britain which is why I'm
not about to sit about and say nothing when I see or hear
of it or its people being abused by the likes of you!
Or these so called police.
and another thing,
I happen to have served this country as a soldier In a Scottish regiment
of the British army for six years, my father served as a soldier
in the Duke of wellingtons light infantry, and the Royal engineers,
My mother served as a signals officer in the RAF,
I have no end of respect for the crown, this country and the Royal family,
and unlike you will defend it to the death if needs be!!
I happen to be one of the people who daily makes an effort to maintain the
"Great" in Great Britain, despite the efforts of these gangsters and likes of you!!
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
6:49pm Fri 9 Nov 07
I laugh at your ridiculous comments. You must be a 12 year old little boy who, yes, cannot spell, on your Daddys computer, and does not know how to debate. Can you add up? Your father was approximately 30 years too young to even be born in 1814, even if you were 85. So stop making up scandalous lies that make you look "patriotic". You are a joke.
And how in God's name can you say I won't defend my country?! I happen to be a military historian, and I can **** well say I know a lot more about 'this country' than you! So stop disrespecting me. Stop making yourself look good.
How dare you call me a mental case. The only thing wrong with Great Britain is YOU.
And how in God's name can you say I won't defend my country?! I happen to be a military historian, and I can **** well say I know a lot more about 'this country' than you! So stop disrespecting me. Stop making yourself look good.
How dare you call me a mental case. The only thing wrong with Great Britain is YOU.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
11:28pm Fri 9 Nov 07
My father, now dead, 1983 aged 73, served in this regiment in ww2 before transferring to the Royal engineers where I believe he spent 1946 clearing mines from Morcamb Beach!! I am sending this web page to the now disbanded remains of the Dukes ( 8 or nine members of this very fine british regiment, won the Victoria cross) For their opinion on your comments, I think it important that the ex members should be given the chance to read what is said of them, and their efforts, by the nations (MILITERY HISTORIANS) there are a number of amature historians still to be found in the remains of the of the regiments ranks, and Im sure that they will value your comments , possibly even enugh to grant you some professional exposure in the journal, Who knows it might even be your big break!!
Lets not leave Mother out of it eh, Also now dead 1973 Aged 59 served as a WAAF signals officer on bomber stations all over England throughout the whole of ww2 (Shed think you an unspeakable Pill as well)
For my part Still not dead, Aged 47, I served with the Kings own Scottish borderers from 1979 to 1985 reg no 24506646 , They too are now gone Bliars vermin thought fit to replace a once very able army with an Ammerican style mob, Ah well Oh Incidentaly, though now disbanded, we too still have our regimental journal and of course Ill do my bit to help get you the exposure craved by every profesional MILITARY HISTORIAN. Im sure that corporal Bill Heany would love to be allowed to avail himself of your services, Oh incidentally where are you quoted? And Ill forward some of your works!
Right,, enugh of this drivel you insufferable little ****, No one so lacking in balls as to alow itself to stand by passivly, Far less actively condone the behaviour of these arseholes, would even nearly come close to fighting so much as a bairn never mind turning up for a war, You wouldnt defend your own mother !! Bsides Itd be difficult from behind her skirts! Maybe even get yr own frock cought in the rammy! Desperate stuff eh? As for disrespecting you, You cant even begin to imagine how little I respect You!, **** it, even I dont know how little I respect you! Need to invent some sort of social microscope or something and have a look!!
Tell you what Ill give you the benefit of the doubt,Lets wait for the response from the afore mentioned organisations on your comments before we decide that youre a germ of some sort.
Lets not leave Mother out of it eh, Also now dead 1973 Aged 59 served as a WAAF signals officer on bomber stations all over England throughout the whole of ww2 (Shed think you an unspeakable Pill as well)
For my part Still not dead, Aged 47, I served with the Kings own Scottish borderers from 1979 to 1985 reg no 24506646 , They too are now gone Bliars vermin thought fit to replace a once very able army with an Ammerican style mob, Ah well Oh Incidentaly, though now disbanded, we too still have our regimental journal and of course Ill do my bit to help get you the exposure craved by every profesional MILITARY HISTORIAN. Im sure that corporal Bill Heany would love to be allowed to avail himself of your services, Oh incidentally where are you quoted? And Ill forward some of your works!
Right,, enugh of this drivel you insufferable little ****, No one so lacking in balls as to alow itself to stand by passivly, Far less actively condone the behaviour of these arseholes, would even nearly come close to fighting so much as a bairn never mind turning up for a war, You wouldnt defend your own mother !! Bsides Itd be difficult from behind her skirts! Maybe even get yr own frock cought in the rammy! Desperate stuff eh? As for disrespecting you, You cant even begin to imagine how little I respect You!, **** it, even I dont know how little I respect you! Need to invent some sort of social microscope or something and have a look!!
Tell you what Ill give you the benefit of the doubt,Lets wait for the response from the afore mentioned organisations on your comments before we decide that youre a germ of some sort.
Andrew, Nottinghamshire, England says...
6:41pm Sat 10 Nov 07
Wonder why it disbanded? Maybe because of you. I can't be bothered with talking to a begrudged Scotsman in a mid-life crisis. I hope you learn to be sociable and actually able to talk to women other than spend your life complaining about 'how it is'. You are pathetic. Your life is pathetic. Your ideals are pathetic. Your spelling is pathetic. You do not serve this country. Do not tell me what I will and will not do for this country. You are pathetic. I will not be back on this page, so say whatever the **** you want. Oh and one more thing. **** You.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
1:53am Tue 13 Nov 07
Er..Yes....right !
Jack, Europe says...
6:04pm Fri 16 Nov 07
This is ridiculous . In the last 6 months the british government has engaged in a massive PR campaign to make the general public fearful of guns. There are so few REAL guns on british streets that they've started a fear campaign about things that could possibly be converted into something that can fire a bullet (even though bullets are unavailable too) . It's so much easier to engineer a gun from scratch than it is to convert a replica (less dangerous too) .
Targeting replica guns is more about targeting people who are interesting in guns than guns themselves - Its all for the database . Most brits have never seen a real gun , let alone gun crime , but let there minds get warped by the news and all of a sudden they're an authority on gun crime . A healthy 20yr old has more chance of suddenly dropping dead from a heart-attack than being the victim of a shooting . Most of the recent shootings were actually from air-rifles but caliber information was withheld for the purpose of manipulating the public . It's true , most of the English have become serious **** . They do f*** all to protect there familys and blame simple technologys for there failure . It's really pathetic , weak and sad . I feel sorry for the English , I really do - the british media have twisted there minds so much they barely resemble free thinking beings . I dont know exactly what the government is trying to acheive , but if it wasnt for the complete pussification of fine english minds , then the revolution would have already began .
Targeting replica guns is more about targeting people who are interesting in guns than guns themselves - Its all for the database . Most brits have never seen a real gun , let alone gun crime , but let there minds get warped by the news and all of a sudden they're an authority on gun crime . A healthy 20yr old has more chance of suddenly dropping dead from a heart-attack than being the victim of a shooting . Most of the recent shootings were actually from air-rifles but caliber information was withheld for the purpose of manipulating the public . It's true , most of the English have become serious **** . They do f*** all to protect there familys and blame simple technologys for there failure . It's really pathetic , weak and sad . I feel sorry for the English , I really do - the british media have twisted there minds so much they barely resemble free thinking beings . I dont know exactly what the government is trying to acheive , but if it wasnt for the complete pussification of fine english minds , then the revolution would have already began .
Phil, Georgia, USA says...
8:10pm Fri 16 Nov 07
I think that people ridiculing Britain are stupid. Look at my country. And Jack, you are probably from Sweden.
Robert Todd, Scotland says...
12:48am Sat 17 Nov 07
Phil I don't care where the guy is from,He's right,Tony B"liar" and his degenerate band of petty criminals Have spread hysteria and left wing or (politburo correct)dung all over the country, These low life (while driving motor cars) found within their hypocricy ridden minds the cappacity to ban smokers from lighting up in the pub and worse from opening a club for themselves!! One of many incidents in B"Liars"/new labours, littany of shame!I neither smoke nor drink but used to meet freands in the pub, I'll never set foot in such a misserable den in this country ever again, If a lad peacefully having a smoke isn't fit to sit with these people, then said people are in no way fit to be anywhere near me, as for america the home of the lynch mob and the "ban it brigade" (remember prohibition?)your country is responsible for more of this skank than you'd think, Turn on a television set and nine out of ten channels you will find Americans behaving like the very lowest of arseholes,This muck is being soaked up by the nations least able citizens, personaly i'd throw the thing out, But to get back to my point, The guy is right The great is rapidly leaving Britain, and many of these sad broken creatures are genuinly scared of toy guns, A free and able people have very few restictions on what they may legaly posess these people are neither free nor able, They are caged and craven, But you never Know there are still real people in Britain who aren't put off by the odds, so lets wait and see. Y'know I can't see a picture of B"Liar" or his nest o vermin without imediatly thinking of that enduring image of Mussolini on his last photo shoot visit to a garage in Milan!
Mik Lawson, southport says...
8:28am Fri 30 Nov 07
Sounds like the Police were bored & had nothing else to do but take legally owned property because they looked like guns.The ownership of RIFs isn't illegal & to confiscate them for the safety of the public in case they fall into the wrong hands is one huge load of rubbish.I for one wouldn't have co-operated & would demand my property be returned.Anyone who legally collects RIFs stands a chance of having their property being confiscated if they come into contact with the Police for any reasons,it just sounds like theft by the Police.At the end of the day the only people who will suffer under the VCR bill is the law abiding citizens while the criminal will still continue to possess illegally held firearms with no consideration for the safety of the public at large!
Ernest Hemingway, Los Angeles says...
6:29am Wed 5 Dec 07
ha ha, what a sad and pathetic place England has become. readily convertable, hmm, DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW DIFFICULT IT IS; it's easier to start from scratch than to convert a blank gun to fire live ammunition.
I have a very large arms completely legal collection and really get a kick out of the hysteria about deactivated and replica guns being readily convertable, encourage the criminals to do it, these replicas are made from plastic and zinc, they will BLOW UP!
If a criminal wants a gun he will get one, there will always be ways, you need to go after the criminals, not the poor egg who plays with toyguns in the evnings.
The blind leading the blind. Hysterical English nit wits!
Actually if the old boy had the collection where it could be seen from the street he deserves whatever foolish punishment your government cares to hand out, for being an IDIOT.
I have a very large arms completely legal collection and really get a kick out of the hysteria about deactivated and replica guns being readily convertable, encourage the criminals to do it, these replicas are made from plastic and zinc, they will BLOW UP!
If a criminal wants a gun he will get one, there will always be ways, you need to go after the criminals, not the poor egg who plays with toyguns in the evnings.
The blind leading the blind. Hysterical English nit wits!
Actually if the old boy had the collection where it could be seen from the street he deserves whatever foolish punishment your government cares to hand out, for being an IDIOT.
Dale, norfolk says...
10:23pm Wed 5 Dec 07
Um im slightly confused to why people are talking about how guns are illegal and the police did their job in raiding his house. he DIDNT have guns, he had REPLICA'S which are NOT illegal to own.
Peter, Uk & Ireland says...
10:18pm Wed 2 Jan 08
The yanks are right- the rights of the Brits have gone down the drain and we not allowed to defend ourselves unless we are prepared for a prison sentance longer than the criminal. The Uk government has pushed us further & further away from the good being able to defend ourselves and now the criminals take charge.
Does this sound familiar? A criminal breaks into a UK home- he wants money to pay for his drug addiction and no-one is going to get in his way. He is prepared to kill if he has to.
He breaks in and trips on something and lands heavily and knocks himself out.
The owner of the house wakes up and calls the police who arrest the man who breaks in.After talking to the criminal the police arrest the owner of the house for negligence. Turns out the owner was in the middle of DIY to his property and he recieved a bigger sentance than the criminal.
Yay! Good old UK! No longer great, now taken over by the criminals.
Does this sound familiar? A criminal breaks into a UK home- he wants money to pay for his drug addiction and no-one is going to get in his way. He is prepared to kill if he has to.
He breaks in and trips on something and lands heavily and knocks himself out.
The owner of the house wakes up and calls the police who arrest the man who breaks in.After talking to the criminal the police arrest the owner of the house for negligence. Turns out the owner was in the middle of DIY to his property and he recieved a bigger sentance than the criminal.
Yay! Good old UK! No longer great, now taken over by the criminals.
chris, England says...
12:51pm Sat 12 Jan 08
The laws in place in britain are there for the benefit of the population. we cant bear arms unless we have a license, thats just the way it is. I think that cracking down on people with replica firearms and plastic toys is rediculous but i can understand why, if confronted with one of those replicas the police would shoot, they would have no way of telling if it is real or not and have to make a split second decision. the thing im most discusted at is the responces to this of the American's and european's who have posted here. we have plenty of rights thanks and id rather live in a country without a load of gun totting maniacs. callin us sissies and wankers because we dont agree with every one being able to get there hands on lethal weaponry, you make me sick, you live in a country where in one year in new york you have more gun crime than in our entire country. violance seems to be the only thing you understand. your rite a criminal who wants a gun whether they are illegal or not will be able to get one, but its better they get a small amount illegally than handing them out on the street! most of the comments there i agree with, i have little or no faith in our police, iv been threatend by someone with a pistol and the police did nothing untill we actually went to the station and shouted like mad at them, but if you want to put forword your opinions about our laws,and what you think is wrong with them do it in a way that isnt just being a big headed arrogant yank who holds the typical view that america is a perfect country and superior to everyone else, tell us whats wrong here when you've sorted yourselfs out, not all brits are for the laws surrounding firearms and luckily for america not all americans are like you.
lost cause, uk says...
10:47am Mon 21 Jan 08
I fell sorry for the old man who has lost his fake guns. some ppl take great pride in collecting items .and yes he could have been robbed by a gang and he could have been hit by a train this happens world over !!! the uk ppl are stupid as am i we sit back and let the goverment do as they plz labour has messed losing 25 mil ov personal uk info and thing are going from bad to worse with them . and why!!!!! caurse they want to lose the nxt time we vote so we all vote for the cons and they will say we are cleaning up labours mess ,so more tax tax tax and geting up the arse thats what we brits do best.
PHIL, uk says...
3:47am Sun 13 Apr 08
1. Most gun crime is commited BY CRIMINALS so firearms laws and others will have no effect on them....punishing law abiding gun owners makes a mockey of the law.
2. guns ARE legal here...Most handguns are banned except for muzzle loading, shot, historic, co2 or air pistols
3. the states DO HAVE GUN LAWS.in fact in NY you need a license for about any gun going including airguns and air soft toys. Washington DC have banned handguns...and verious other states have inacted other gun laws.
4. the police would have needed a warrant to search and seize any guns from the poor bloke's house unless they plan to arrest him first.
5. VCR bill has NOT outlawed possosion of replica guns just to sale and import them
6. putting lawul citzens in prison for shooting a criminal in lawful self defence '...using resonable force for the prevention fo crime' (Criminal Law Act 1967 spite what the police say you CAN use a firearm to defend yourself)
makes the criminal laugh at ALL OF US knowing that he can do what he likes and is protected by the crown if the subject dares to defend himself. Since the criminal by defination does not give a **** toss about the law...maby enacting further and further stupid gun laws will DO NOTHING to prevent the criminal from using or getting a gun...surly it would be better to ENFORCE the law as it stands and give out TOUGHER sentences (like they do in US) to them and NOT punish the lawful person denfending himself.
ps. if someone does aim a staring pistol at a so19 copper and then dies well so what he shouldnt of done that in the frist place.
we are really are turning into a nation of **** especailly people in this country just seem to take it!!
THE GOVERNMENT IS THE SERVENT OF THE PEOPLE
POLICING IN THE UK IS DONE BY CONSENT OF THE PEOPLE
THE POLICE ARE NOT DUTY BOUND TO PROCTECT THE INDVIDUAL
2. guns ARE legal here...Most handguns are banned except for muzzle loading, shot, historic, co2 or air pistols
3. the states DO HAVE GUN LAWS.in fact in NY you need a license for about any gun going including airguns and air soft toys. Washington DC have banned handguns...and verious other states have inacted other gun laws.
4. the police would have needed a warrant to search and seize any guns from the poor bloke's house unless they plan to arrest him first.
5. VCR bill has NOT outlawed possosion of replica guns just to sale and import them
6. putting lawul citzens in prison for shooting a criminal in lawful self defence '...using resonable force for the prevention fo crime' (Criminal Law Act 1967 spite what the police say you CAN use a firearm to defend yourself)
makes the criminal laugh at ALL OF US knowing that he can do what he likes and is protected by the crown if the subject dares to defend himself. Since the criminal by defination does not give a **** toss about the law...maby enacting further and further stupid gun laws will DO NOTHING to prevent the criminal from using or getting a gun...surly it would be better to ENFORCE the law as it stands and give out TOUGHER sentences (like they do in US) to them and NOT punish the lawful person denfending himself.
ps. if someone does aim a staring pistol at a so19 copper and then dies well so what he shouldnt of done that in the frist place.
we are really are turning into a nation of **** especailly people in this country just seem to take it!!
THE GOVERNMENT IS THE SERVENT OF THE PEOPLE
POLICING IN THE UK IS DONE BY CONSENT OF THE PEOPLE
THE POLICE ARE NOT DUTY BOUND TO PROCTECT THE INDVIDUAL
V, uk says...
12:47am Mon 14 Apr 08
looking at the photo of the guns, some of them are co2 (gas) powered handguns that fire lead pellets.....so these are not replica guns!!! stupid press !!!!!!!!!!!!1
Mike, Uxbridge says...
12:19pm Mon 14 Apr 08
Yes they are replica guns. The term gun is used out of context a better term would be firearm. The gentleman in question collects RIF's or real imitation firearms which means that yes they are capable of firing some sort of projectile. Which is still completely legal especiallas he is already in posession of the item and not trying to newly purchase one.
PHIL - yes the VCRB does ban the sale an importation of RIF's in this country unless you have a UKARA license. This was a measure put in place by british airsofters as a measure to stop the government from altogether banning the weapons. Whilst I agree that licensing is a good idea it is still another case of the innocent suffering due to the few idiots out there. That includes silly toy and cornershop owners selling spring powered airsoft pistols to anyone instead of following british regulations. Oh, and please don't call airsoft weapons toys, it is this precise attitude which has caused problems, if people took them seriously and did not see them or sell them as toys many of these problems could have been prohibited.
PHIL - yes the VCRB does ban the sale an importation of RIF's in this country unless you have a UKARA license. This was a measure put in place by british airsofters as a measure to stop the government from altogether banning the weapons. Whilst I agree that licensing is a good idea it is still another case of the innocent suffering due to the few idiots out there. That includes silly toy and cornershop owners selling spring powered airsoft pistols to anyone instead of following british regulations. Oh, and please don't call airsoft weapons toys, it is this precise attitude which has caused problems, if people took them seriously and did not see them or sell them as toys many of these problems could have been prohibited.
phil, uk says...
5:42pm Tue 15 Apr 08
Mike, airsoft is really a toy, as what damage can it cause....nothing....
.whilst a co2 pistol upwards will cause damage. Yes you are right about vcr bill but existing owners will NOT have to hand in they airsoft crap. In the pic above the are several co2 pistols....these are not replicas these are classed as fireams which are exampt from certification. Soft air does not fall within any of the firearms acts (except for sc.19 carrying an immiation firearm in a public place)and unlike airsoft these co2 pistols will cause damge to someone.
by the way whats does the government think by banning guns, knives, no sex till 21, forced to say in school till 18, commonsense, self defence, cigerattes, drinking more then 3 pints, 'fatty' foods etc....do they really by doing these bans and restictions we will live in some crime free loving utopia where everyone loves each and hold hands and sings peace around the sodding world???????????????
???/ plse any answers as i am really confused with this **** government and even more so as to why we the people let the bastards do this to us????????????
.whilst a co2 pistol upwards will cause damage. Yes you are right about vcr bill but existing owners will NOT have to hand in they airsoft crap. In the pic above the are several co2 pistols....these are not replicas these are classed as fireams which are exampt from certification. Soft air does not fall within any of the firearms acts (except for sc.19 carrying an immiation firearm in a public place)and unlike airsoft these co2 pistols will cause damge to someone.
by the way whats does the government think by banning guns, knives, no sex till 21, forced to say in school till 18, commonsense, self defence, cigerattes, drinking more then 3 pints, 'fatty' foods etc....do they really by doing these bans and restictions we will live in some crime free loving utopia where everyone loves each and hold hands and sings peace around the sodding world???????????????
???/ plse any answers as i am really confused with this **** government and even more so as to why we the people let the bastards do this to us????????????
one more thing, uk says...
5:46pm Tue 15 Apr 08
is a .22lr pistol that looks like a beretta 92fs a replica then as well??
Mike, Uxbridge says...
12:34pm Wed 16 Apr 08
Actually phil they are not toys and can cause a lot of damage and yes they can be classed as section 5 firearms and not RIF's, making them illegal, depending on upgrades etc.
As for damage they can easily blind, cut, knock teeth out etc just the same as co2 pistols or rifles can.
If more people looked at airsoft weapons this way and not as toys there would have been more self implemented control of their sale meaning that pointless acts such as the VCR would not have been needed. And as we can see from the above case, airsofters are nto safe, if the police deem their collections to be of a possible hazard in the unlikely event of a robbery then they are within their rights to take them away.
As for damage they can easily blind, cut, knock teeth out etc just the same as co2 pistols or rifles can.
If more people looked at airsoft weapons this way and not as toys there would have been more self implemented control of their sale meaning that pointless acts such as the VCR would not have been needed. And as we can see from the above case, airsofters are nto safe, if the police deem their collections to be of a possible hazard in the unlikely event of a robbery then they are within their rights to take them away.
phill, someware london says...
3:44pm Sun 20 Apr 08
Mike
actully the police CANNOT SEIZE any property without a warrant (PACE 1984) if they come across an illagel wapon of whatever description including immation wapons, then the person will be arrested and then a search and seize without a warrant will be allowed under sc. 18 PACE 1984 and can be retained SC.19 for use as eveidance in court. The POWER to confiscate any property (e.g an unlawful replica gun) will be ordered by the trial / sentencing court.
i was convicted of carrying an firearm in a publice place WITHOUT lawful authority or resonable excause Sc. 19 Firearms act 1968 the gun in question was a beretta co2 4.5mm handgun and a sliencer unloaded in my car (as i had finished shooting a club) but went to mates house afterwards. anyway, i was found guilty but the Justice of peace ORDERED the return of my co2 handgun, sliencer and ammoution.
ps. YOU can have criminal convictions and have a firearm certificate as well. Long as you were not sentenced to 3 years or more
actully the police CANNOT SEIZE any property without a warrant (PACE 1984) if they come across an illagel wapon of whatever description including immation wapons, then the person will be arrested and then a search and seize without a warrant will be allowed under sc. 18 PACE 1984 and can be retained SC.19 for use as eveidance in court. The POWER to confiscate any property (e.g an unlawful replica gun) will be ordered by the trial / sentencing court.
i was convicted of carrying an firearm in a publice place WITHOUT lawful authority or resonable excause Sc. 19 Firearms act 1968 the gun in question was a beretta co2 4.5mm handgun and a sliencer unloaded in my car (as i had finished shooting a club) but went to mates house afterwards. anyway, i was found guilty but the Justice of peace ORDERED the return of my co2 handgun, sliencer and ammoution.
ps. YOU can have criminal convictions and have a firearm certificate as well. Long as you were not sentenced to 3 years or more
Mike, Uxbridge says...
12:03pm Mon 21 Apr 08
Phil, I am very aware of the legislation and I never stated that a warrant is not needed to seize the said articles. The point I was making was that airsofters are at more risk than ever. Tis all mate.
phil, police state, uk says...
4:48pm Mon 21 Apr 08
yes you right, airsoft is not toys, They could be used as some sort of non-lethal wapon by the police maby not 6mm but .50 cal type havey plastic ball...anyway, yes with this govermeant making laws that the Daily Mail wants...i can see them banning cap guns, water pistols and anything to do with guns......so then there will be no crime no more and we can all hold hands, dance around trees and sing peace around the world....what a load of bullshit....i fed up of this police state government making simplist soloutions to counter crime....heres one idea how about enforcing the law as it stands and hand out tougher sentances.....UK gun law is one of most toughest in the world..
V FOR VEDDETTA, UP URS TONY BLAIR says...
4:53pm Mon 21 Apr 08
WE NEED TO STAND UP BEFORE ITS TOO LATE....WE ARE NOT ALLOWD TO SELD DEFENCE ANYMORE....(R .V. MARTIN) WE ARE OVERUN WITH CRIME....SO THE GOVERNMENT SAYS YOU CANNOT HIT YOUR KIDS BUT YOU WILL BE PUNISHED IF THEY COMMIT CRIME.....WHAT THE **** IS HAPPENING
OUTLAW GUNS ONLY OUTLAWS HAVE GUNS IS VERY VERY TURE.....DOSE ANYONE REALLY THINK THE CRIMINALS WILL LISTEN TO THE LAW....NO THEY WILL GET ONE REGARDLESS....
OUTLAW GUNS ONLY OUTLAWS HAVE GUNS IS VERY VERY TURE.....DOSE ANYONE REALLY THINK THE CRIMINALS WILL LISTEN TO THE LAW....NO THEY WILL GET ONE REGARDLESS....
Mike, Uxbridge says...
11:35am Tue 22 Apr 08
Thanks for the insight V and the polite way in which it was delivered, very informative.
Phil - we all know why they pick on poor defenseless airsofters and collectors, because they cannot enforce the current gun laws because the seem incapable of catching criminals with guns and incapable of stopping the import of such illegal items. But then of course they are willing to waste money stopping the import of airsoft and RIF's, thats nice and easy because they come through the correct, legal official channels, so putting a stop to such evil is easy!
When will this government realise that in order to run a country a certain amount of work does need to be done.
Phil - we all know why they pick on poor defenseless airsofters and collectors, because they cannot enforce the current gun laws because the seem incapable of catching criminals with guns and incapable of stopping the import of such illegal items. But then of course they are willing to waste money stopping the import of airsoft and RIF's, thats nice and easy because they come through the correct, legal official channels, so putting a stop to such evil is easy!
When will this government realise that in order to run a country a certain amount of work does need to be done.
Neil, surrey says...
2:03pm Sat 17 May 08
This is disgracefull, because the police can't find the illigal one they are trying to focus on law abiding citizens, this is not the first case were police emparrased poeple to satisfy themself.
ST, Left the UK says...
2:56pm Sun 8 Jun 08
This just exemplifies the modern UK thought process, and one that made me leave Britain once and for all. Folks think that this isn't a normal institution but while I was there, the use of the populace' brain when dealing with even minor things was something to behold.
Please, vacation somewhere else. This is the type of thinking you will run into in the UK.
Please, vacation somewhere else. This is the type of thinking you will run into in the UK.
wu, says...
2:34am Mon 9 Jun 08
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
there's a reason the party in 1984 was named 'english socialism' after all...
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
there's a reason the party in 1984 was named 'english socialism' after all...
colin, scotland says...
11:27pm Fri 20 Jun 08
i once heard a saying that guns dont kill people but people kill people. i live in scotland but i still maintain that we should have the right to carry weapons to defend ourselves or our families if threatend, so i think the british goverment should wake up and see the truth of what is happening on our streets where the criminals rights are more protected than the innocents so my opinion is the goverment can go to hell.
Geoff, Yorkshire says...
6:03pm Sun 6 Jul 08
I like guns and have had them for many years. But I take offence in what the Yanks are saying about how we were once an Empire and now we take anything. The UK is NOT a free country. Over a million took to the streets of London against the Gulf war. We still went to war and the reason we went to war was proved to be a lie. The terrible strict gun laws stop the type of gun crime you have in the USA happening in the UK. We get the odd drug dealer and poor kid get shot but less in a year than you have in one state in one night! I have a good few friends in the Gulf and they say the Yanks are women rapers and gun hoo. It is historical fact in the first Gulf war we had no losses to the Iraq's but many to the Yanks. The same in this war. I know British soldiers are more scared of the Dumass Yanks smoking dope than of the Iraq's. So yes we stand for a lot but we have a great country with little crime compared with the school massacres that happen every year in the states.
Yes we are a little country but still a power to be reckoned with.
Yes we are a little country but still a power to be reckoned with.
Dave, Cornwall says...
7:46pm Tue 15 Jul 08
I am sick of what the americans have to say about the british people, I am an Englishman
and very proud to be one I also collect military items including rifles and pistols.
When the replica gun ban came in, Oct 07?
it said anyone already in possession of replica weapons can keep them I.E in collections ect, the police had NO right to seize
these guns that were held lawfully and distroy them.
as for the yanks we here in britain have plenty of backbone, all we here from you is how you won the war, well here this you didnt come into the war until 1941 the only reason for that was hitler declaired war on the states
you didnt do anything until 1942 and then sat on your arses until 44 when you along with us and many more went to France. the truth is all you did in the war as far as combat goes is to foight for eight months , when we were fighting for six years so stick that up it.
and very proud to be one I also collect military items including rifles and pistols.
When the replica gun ban came in, Oct 07?
it said anyone already in possession of replica weapons can keep them I.E in collections ect, the police had NO right to seize
these guns that were held lawfully and distroy them.
as for the yanks we here in britain have plenty of backbone, all we here from you is how you won the war, well here this you didnt come into the war until 1941 the only reason for that was hitler declaired war on the states
you didnt do anything until 1942 and then sat on your arses until 44 when you along with us and many more went to France. the truth is all you did in the war as far as combat goes is to foight for eight months , when we were fighting for six years so stick that up it.
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Jim, says...
5:58am Sat 20 Oct 07
There was no discussion of charging him, so I guessing it's the latter.
How does anyone tolerate this?